Competing using gear vs. natural?

[cranny]

I can respect people that compete natty but I still don't understand to a degree. I watched a friend of mine compete natty and he bulked up nicely. But when it came time to cut he lost so much. I also realize genetics play a huge role not to mention if his diet was nailed. This guy lost a great deal of fat but he lost an incredible amount of muscle in the process. It just seemed like an awful lot of hard work down the drain. That would be very disheartening to me. Competing is tough enough. At the time of his comp he hardly had any noticeable muscle mass; lean but not much muscle. I guess what I'm trying to figure out is why people are so dead set against gear when trying to compete. Morals, principles? I dunno. Again, I have much respect for them b/c it's so damn tough.

[TAZ]

I used to do it natty.... all the women I have trained were natty. I have an old training partner that won the northern ohio natural tested comp last year in the heavyweights an he didn't lose much if any size. Its' diet and planning. Natural you can't prep in 14 weeks for a show and not lose size. it's more like 21-24 weeks. So many people think that they have their diets down and they don't. Gear makes up for the gaps.

Why do they do it..... well me for one don't really like being on gear let alone allot of it. Coming off sucks.... the errant shot that leaves you too sore to train a body part... The legalities of obtaining gear..... not wanting gyno or in a womans case permanent changes in facial hair, deepening of the voice.... clitoral enlargement..... there are tons of reasons that people that compete naturally have.

-TAZ

[ashley2212]

Imo, too many people don't push their natural potential to its limits before jumping on the gear band wagon.

[ashley2212]

Not to mention it's kind of illegal, lest we forget that part...

And not to take anything away from people who do use gear because you have to work equally as hard... but there's a certain thrill in knowing as a natty that every gain you make (even though the gains may be smaller) was 100% blood, sweat, and tears with no assistance.

I see nothing wrong with it and I truly wish the natural leagues were really natural. Let the people who want to use compete untested... let the rest of us who do it to push our natural potential compete on a level playing field... but that's a separate topic I could rant about for days.

[Blut Wump]

Even over here there are people who'd prefer to stay away from gear. I think it's partly to prejudice; partly to lack of education and needle-phobia and partly for the feeling of having done it without artificially changing your hormones.

The difference is so great, though, that the temptation for many is too much to resist. We really do get guys chatting openly about gear in the hard-core gyms and so supply is easy to come by.

[sassy69]

Its a completely different mindset - there's a much longer path towards "the pros" because you simply can't work w/ anything but what God gave you and A LOT of time & dedication to the building and slicing up of what you've got. Like mentioned above - 14 weeks isn't enough and you still have to learn how your body responds to the bulk up and the cut down w/o dumping everything you gained in the process.

Not to slam the figure girls, but this is a particularly good example of something that has incredibly low barriers to entry because the primary goal is to sell show tickets & federation memberships. Its something that people can do as an exclamation point on weight loss or finally getting in the gym, but when they set their goals higher than just "lose weight & put on the sparkly suit" and realize they can't do it on 9 months in the gym & 5 shows/year, yes you do have to take time off and let your body build. Then if they so choose to go the short route and explore the dark side, all of a sudden the path to the upper ranks is much quicker. An interesting turnaround lately tho is that they now can't just go for the hard & lean, but rather have to manage the whole thing to come in "just right" - somewhere between hard & lean and soft & squishy w/ the right proportions, good hair & makeup and a pretty face.

(I hope that didn't sound too harsh.... I'm still skewed to old school BB --- still w/ all the respect in the world to those who pursue any physique competition and get that its not something you just show up for & expect a trophy.)

[sassy69]

Further thought - unless you've competed at least once natural or are surrounded for many years by people who have cycled,. you have no business playing on the dark side. Simple as that.

And even further, if you plan to compete "unnaturally", find someone who has LOTS of experience on the dark side. People who have never gone on the dark side or have never prepped someone using enhancement dont' know jack shit and you need to run from them like the plague and find someone who has experience to learn from. There are LOTS of people who claim to be trainers but if they've never competed or trained people who have competed (with LOTS of experience) they aren't going to be able to comprehend what is involved.

[KKAZ]

I was told to come back next year on juice,when i first competed. So, i did. HAHA! jk.

[¼LB'er]

Without getting all technical with mumbo jumbo. Some people compete naturally for many simple reasons...being competitive, staying fit, healthy, and just looking good. Some people, as a matter of alot of people don't desire the big, vascular, and ripped look.

[¼LB'er]

Originally Posted by TAZ

I used to do it natty.... all the women I have trained were natty. I have an old training partner that won the northern ohio natural tested comp last year in the heavyweights an he didn't lose much if any size. Its' diet and planning. Natural you can't prep in 14 weeks for a show and not lose size. it's more like 21-24 weeks. So many people think that they have their diets down and they don't. Gear makes up for the gaps.

Why do they do it..... well me for one don't really like being on gear let alone allot of it. Coming off sucks.... the errant shot that leaves you too sore to train a body part... The legalities of obtaining gear..... not wanting gyno or in a womans case permanent changes in facial hair, deepening of the voice.... clitoral enlargement..... there are tons of reasons that people that compete naturally have.

-TAZ

Well said!!!!

[WonderWoman]

Originally Posted by ashley2212

Not to mention it's kind of illegal, lest we forget that part...

And not to take anything away from people who do use gear because you have to work equally as hard... but there's a certain thrill in knowing as a natty that every gain you make (even though the gains may be smaller) was 100% blood, sweat, and tears with no assistance.

I see nothing wrong with it and I truly wish the natural leagues were really natural. Let the people who want to use compete untested... let the rest of us who do it to push our natural potential compete on a level playing field... but that's a separate topic I could rant about for days.

I have my days and wonder what gear what do to my physique, I hear it all the time, "imagine what a cycle would do you" bla bla "you would be huge", lol.. Makes me wonder what if? Being natty is not easy in all this and sometimes goes unnoticed as well. People with good genetics off the back are already put on the bandwagon without even going down that road. I think even though you still need to work hard on gear and dedicate diet and training just as much, you still have that on your plate when the mental setbacks kick in. Mentally for me atleast I have had so much ups/downs with this. I have good days and just some bad days where I don't think I will get to where I need to be or that I JUST don't want to. Its like a battle.. Give me some carbs will ya

[ashley2212]

I'd be surprised if you could find a natural competitor who hasn't at least considered using. It's tempting but it's all about an individual choice (whatever the reasons may be), what you want out of your physique, and what your ultimate goals are.

[ashley2212]

Originally Posted by ¼LB'er

Without getting all technical with mumbo jumbo. Some people compete naturally for many simple reasons...being competitive, staying fit, healthy, and just looking good. Some people, as a matter of alot of people don't desire the big, vascular, and ripped look.

Quote for truth

[IronSlade]

Originally Posted by sassy69

Further thought - unless you've competed at least once natural or are surrounded for many years by people who have cycled,. you have no business playing on the dark side. Simple as that.

I don't know that I can agree with this. If its only meant for people who compete, then fine, I really have no say in that. I have never had any desire to compete. But since some of the comments here have gone away from strictly competing, I will throw in my thoughts. I want to look a certain way. It doesnt take too long around the lifting scene to figure out what would give you a big boost to your goals. So I did. So do a lot of people. And yeah, its still hard work, hitting the gym every day, watching what we eat, etc.

I guess another way of saying it is that my goal was to look a certain way. So if I look that way then my goal is accomplished, my goal was in the end result not in the process. I guess its more of a "the ends justify the means" kind of issue for me.

Personally, I would rather use gear and be able to have the nutrition slightly off and still get the results I want. If I am going to be in the gym lifting iron everyday then I want the most bang for my buck. And as I get older, I dont want to settle for looking older. Maybe my outlook is different because I am looking at using gear to build/maintain a certain look and lifestyle. As I said, I don't compete, so I don't want to spend 24 weeks of super strict dieting to look good for the summer, its not worth it when I can spend less than half that. But then bodybuilding is something I do in life, not my whole life.

If bodybuilding were my life or my livelihood or even thought about competing then how could you not use gear when you know everyone else is? How could you think you could stand a chance against the current top level competitors without it (and I mean on a more local level too, not just nationally. It's no amateur hour at my state's Mr. (state) competition). My bet is that if the comp's not tested then at least one person is on and at that point you are playing with the deck stacked against you.

[sassy69]

My statement was very specifically about competing. You always see people who are more interested getting to competition shape quickly vs spending the time to build a physique for competition. I.e. they think the juice is what gets you to stage quality vs starting w/ your body, learning how to manipulate your body / how it responds and then, if you so choose, intelligently seeking different routes of enhancements. Usually they make poor choices because they didn't take the time to learn how to cycle correctly, much less taking the time to work on their bodies naturally first. IMO if you haven't already gone thru that learning process, you've completely missed the point of being in a position to make intelligent decisions about self medication.

[ashley2212]

Originally Posted by IronSlade

If bodybuilding were my life or my livelihood or even thought about competing then how could you not use gear when you know everyone else is? How could you think you could stand a chance against the current top level competitors without it (and I mean on a more local level too, not just nationally. It's no amateur hour at my state's Mr. (state) competition). My bet is that if the comp's not tested then at least one person is on and at that point you are playing with the deck stacked against you.

This has nothing to do with the original post. His friend competes naturally for likely all the reasons stated throughout the thread. Not everyone that competes in bodybuilding does it for their livelihood or to compete on a national level - that's the point.

If the competition is untested you can pretty much guarantee every single one of them is or was using. Hell, even in natty competitions you can tell many of them stopped in enough time to pass a urine test.

You're stupid to go into an untested competition without using, imo. I'm not even sure freakish genetics would cut it. But again, that's not the point. I doubt his friend is competing in untested competitions.


I also saw nothing in sassy's post that suggested she thinks people who don't compete shouldn't use.