E2 & BROS........WHAT SHOULD I ADD TO THIS MASS CYCLE?

[MONSTROSITY]

Here's what I have outlined for my upcoming mass cycle:

wk----aratest---suspension----EQ
1------1000------100ED---------300
2------1000------100ED---------300
3------1000------100ED---------300
4------1000--------------------300
5------1000--------------------300
6------1000--------------------300
7------1000--------------------300
8------1000--------------------300
9------750---------------------300
10-----750---------------------300
11-----------------------------300
12-----------------------------300
clomid EOD arimidex wk1-3 1/2mg ED

I was thinking of adding an oral like anavar starting week4, after ending the test suspension. I want to avoid a mini crash from the test suspension. D-bol would alos be a nice fit for 3 weeks maybe weeks4-6 at 50mg ED. But I am uncertain about the d-bol, I am trying to keep some of my hair!! I am told there is no way to guard against d-bol induced hairloss. If you guys think the cycle looks good the way it is then I might not change anything.......

BUILT BY BLOOD, DRIVEN BY TESTOSTERONE

[This message was edited by MONSTROSITY on 11-26-2000 at 08:51 PM.]

[Big Bad Booty Daddy]

I'd definetly put in some type of oral. My guess is Anavar or maybe Halo.

[MONSTROSITY]

Is halo hard on the hair? I will be using propecia and xandrox to combat hairloss.

[300 kleen]

Why are you running the Eq throughout the cycle? You will not see anything from it because you will be holding so much water from the Ara.

How many cycles have you done?

http://www.angelfire.com/linux/roids/images/angel.gif


300 kleen

[MONSTROSITY]

300 Kleen,

I have done 4 cycles in the last 10 months. I disagree with your statement, that I will not see anything from the EQ.

[This message was edited by MONSTROSITY on 11-26-2000 at 08:43 PM.]

[TEXASAMM]

And add D-bol for 4 weeks, then A50 for 4 weeks
Now that being said then it will be a somewhat Monster Mass Cycle.
Add alittle Winstrol with the A50 and your set.
The Q. about the EQ well I have done similar cycles as this one and the EQ ,I can take it or leave it.I couldn't tell if I was getting any benifit from it or not .So if this was my cycle I would sell the EQ and buy winstrol to start on week 4 then start the A50 on week 5.

[MONSTROSITY]

I am using EQ right now and I like what I am feeling. I do understand where you guys are coming from, but it has been my experience that anabolics help retain gains from a cycle rich in androgens.

[TEXASAMM]

that is the thing that has never made since to me.Androgenic steroids are very anabolic also more anabolic than most "anabolic steroids"
and IMHO using EQ at 300mgsEW is not going to make you hold onto your muscle after cycle anymore than not using it.(how is it supposed to do that anyway)
yes you will gain more water weight on androgens but you will also gain more muscle.After you stop your cycle you will lose the water,and some muscle but you will have more muscle in the end.
You asked for a monster mass cycle and you still get your high anabolic drug WINSTROL which is a better drug than EQ anyway.
If you are on the EQ right now what else are you on and at what week .You didn't state that you have already started your monster mass cycle.

Well now I see you have edited your questions
from wanting a "monster mass cycle" to wanting a "mass cycle".I don't think we agree on cycle doses because I wouldn't call 1700mgs of TEST for 3 weeks with 300mgs of EQ massive.I would do 2gms of TEST all the way thru and no less than 500mgs-600mgs of EQ with, and I would never ever forget about the D-BOL and ANADROL.If you like how EQ makes you feel WAIT until you do a combination of these drugs.

[This message was edited by TEXASAMM on 11-26-2000 at 10:31 PM.]

[DREXX]

Dbol and Abombs for 8 weeks total that is crazy...

Anyway I would throw in an oral in week 4,5,6,7...

Either Dbol, drol, winny

Anavar is too expensive, Halo isn't very good for mass

If it's not hard it's not worth doing...

[E2]

Yup i'd pop in the dbol at week 4, Texasamm i'm glad to have you around!!!!!! Nice to see another androgen lover!!!

Try 10-20dbol/day for 4-9

That'll stick some nice mass on ya!!!

http://bobjewson.tripod.com/e2.jpg

[TEXASAMM]

Bro,
What where your lab results like during your last cycle?and what were they when you finished?
After 10 weeks of T.SUSP.@1500mgs,A50@100mgs and up to 150mgs and FINA@525mgs straight thru.
My lab results were normal.NOTHING was out of range.My doctor tells me I am in extremely good health.
So my question is why do you think 4 weeks of D'bol and 4weeks of A50 is crazy?You ever do it?Or are you just restating what you have learned on the internet.
When I give advice on a cycle or a drug it is only from personal experience if I havent done that drug I don't talk about it.I wish more did the same.
Do you know there are studies done with Anadrol given to undernurished aneimic children taking up to 5 tabs a day for over 3 months straight.If you want the studies I will e-mail them to you.
When I read that I think that is crazy but it makes me think.These children are not healthy to begin with.And the are under a physicions care.
I don't know how many years you have taken AS and how many different drugs you have taken.
But I have uses AS since 1986.Alot of things are different now than in the 80's.AND alot of things are still the same.Alot more knowledge is available.But the best knowledge is still 1st hand experiences.
(you know I stopped gaining On a cycle once and I was already taking D-bol.So I added ANADROL together with the D-bol.after a 3 or 4 weeks I went to the Dr. to get blood work done my liver enzymes were slightly elevated but still in range.
So please share with us your experiences.That is what is important. I am always curious about how other peoples cycles go and what the think they would change and why .What about you...

[DREXX]

TEXASAMM:

First off everyone is entitled to their own opinion right?

I simply stated my opinion which is not taking 17AA for more than 5 weeks. I never said my opinion is the best one but it's MY opinion.

Not everyone has a super liver. I just like to err on the safe side. Better be safe than sorry. I want to make my use of AAS as safe as possible.

I am glad that your liver enzymes where fine after your last cycle but is this the case with everyone?

The chemical structure of the 17 alpha alkalyl makes it harder for the liver to process so the drug stays active longer.

I have seen the studies with Anadrol at 5 or more tabs/day in undernurished children. It makes me scratch my head and wonder...

How are their liver enzymes? What about those who are prone to progesterone gyno. At 250mg anadrol per day that will give you one hell of a nice pair of tits.

Admitidly I haven't used many drugs and haven't been using for years.

I have been using for the last 3 years and have only done 5 cycles.

Does this mean I don't know what I am talking about and not knowlegdeable to state my opinion here?

Anyway this wasn't meant to be nasty because I respect everyone on this board and don't mean to start up shit /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

If it's not hard it's not worth doing...

[TEXASAMM]

You never answered my Question!What were your blood test results during your last cycle and what were they after the cycle.
Surely you get blood tests done since you stand on the side of safety as you put it.
You said you haven't done many cycles but you know your shit.Well good for you...let's
see... Tell me when your liver enzymes were elevated, after your 5th week of D-bol?Surely you do know?Have you ever done an oral longer?You must have some basis to make your claim that doing an 17AA for more than 5 weeks is TOO hard on your liver?
You know what I find funny Drexx?Is that everyone says how bad steroids are for you.But us bodybuilders know the truth,Then get us bodybuilders together and some spout crap about how bad the androgens are ,and the 17AA's'!Like FEAR the androgens.
So Drexx show me those blood tests that say how fucked up your liver was after 4 weeks of D-bol and TEST!
I don't think you get your blood work done!I don't think you really know how bad Androgens are on your liver.I think most of your knowledge is from books and the internet.
So this is my advice to you.Start getting your blood work done and find out for yourself how bad steroids are for you.That is the only thing that matters.You can't get that kind of knowledge on AS from books and the internet these are just tools somewhere to start from. the real knowledge comes from your own experiences with the drugs on your own body.GOOD LUCK TO YOU I hope your not a knucklehead so then you can learn something ..

[TEXASAMM]

I hope you are not taking what I am saying as trying to be nasty.because I am not.You have every right to your opinions.I am just trying to find out and for you to see,What are this opinions based on!
I don't post much on elite.Because of all the ...well you know.But I was hoping that this board would be different .A board that the members can really talk about how we really do steroids and what we think it takes to grow and look freaky .I would like to see E2 last cycle and The SAINT as well as THE TRUTH and the boys he trains in NYC.
Shit like what they had to do to get down to 1.5%BF and retain as much muscle as possible how they filled out just in time for the show and what the would do differenty when they missed their peak.
I want to know shit like what it takes to for someone to get up to 250lbs. and in the single digits BF%.Because I ain't there yet...

[DREXX]

Well Texasamm you are right I don't get my blood work done and I really should.

You obviously have been around the block and know your shit. I respect that and hope to learn from you.

I don't have much experience but I try to base my opinions on as much things as possible.

My limited experience, books, internet sites and many people (in person and here). The general concensus is to stay away from 17AA's more than 5 weeks. That is what I base my opinion on.

I realise that lots of people have regular liver enzymes even after a heavy and long cycle of 17aa's.

My local dealer is doing 150mg of abomb's per day now for about 6-8 weeks along with 1500mg of Enanthate per week and his doc says his liver enzymes are normal. The doc doesn't understand it. This guy doesn't take any milk thistle or nothing...

He is now 240lbs at 5'8" and says that everything is working fine. However when I see him he is exhausted just climbing into the jeep. Weird???

I will keep on lookout for your posts because you can surely teach me a thing or two.

Take care bro


If it's not hard it's not worth doing...

[archive_Ulter]

I don't want to get in the middle of this but I was on D-bol for 14 months straight once and my liver was fine. (AM still has a hard time with that) TEXAXSAMM is right and DREXX acknowledges that it is a real good idea to get your blood work done on a regular basis. Preferably with a doc who knows what you do. They are hard to find but they are out there.

[flexed1]

want to hear fucked up here is my last blood test results which were done in August. My show was in May and at the time i was only on EQ when this was taken so its concerning to me.

SGPT( Liver enzyme) 59 normal range 0-45
HDL Cholesterol 21 LOW Normal 31-59
LDL (CALCULATED) 190 High Normal 90-171
LDL/HDL Ratio 9.08 H Normal 1.52-5.52

I guess I have a year to live. My contest cycle consisted of Halo, Winny, Primo, Masteron, EQ, and Test (up to 4 weeks out). So you figure 3 months after my show and on Equipose only these results are not impressive. Now bulking up and quite frankly am afraid of what things are now. /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

[archive_FitnessChick]

If you did decide to add the oral,Wouldn't anavar be much less effective in a mass cycle then dbol----granted it is a lot easier on the liver and less androgenic, but if you are looking for a true mass cycle then it is easy to see that dbol would be the better choice of the 2....

[WarLobo]

The main point is, if your going do more than one cycle a year, get your blood work done. You never know, this is a tool by which we get NON-subjective information on the status of our condition. I'm sort of lucky as my good friend and BB judge is a cardiac care RN, and I even get to have an ultra sound of my heart any time. Course I have to have a 1/4 cc of sust for her too /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

M, for mass, shit dude, test, deca and dbol (or A50's) Can't really go wong with this set up for the first few years of cycle lifting

LAte

Lobo

[archive_Bchemist]

How AS is going to affect you is largely genetic with respect to the receptors in muscle as well as negative sides that show up in blood work. We know of people who are thin, eat healthy, etc, but have hypercolesteria where their cholesterol is abnormally high. My friend comes from a long line of men like this who have all died of heart attacks after suffering early and frequent in their lives. My friend is very skinny, yet he has the cholesterol levels of an obese person.

My point here is that some people may never, even after years of constant use, see any negative side effects. But others who are sensitive, similiar in principle to my friend with the cholesterol trouble, will have negative blood levels even at miniscule doses. It is a good idea to get a blood test to determine which type fits your profile, and then weigh the risks/rewards accordingly.