THE CUBS GET NOMAR.

[archive_MR. BMJ]

The Red Sox are a bunch of MORONS! I'm bettin' that there are a lot of happy Cubs fans. Since i'm a Yankee's fan, I sure am. Nomar should have been a Red Sox for the remaining of his career. Man, that guy is awesome...I can't believe it. YES...I do know he has been hurt.

What is everybody's feelings on this.

BMJ

[archive_Mickey]

Well, I'll tell you my feelings.

The Red Sox are not morons and I think you are thinking that Garciaparra is better than he really is. They need defense and they got it. Cabrera is a really good player yet nobody really knows about him. Mientkewitz (or however you spell it) also has a great glove and last time I checked Ortiz could barely catch routein grounders.

Garciaparra, as most scouts suggest, is getting worse every year and his skills are already declining. Yes he set a high standard for himself but most would agree that he is not in the class of Tejada, Jeter, ARod or even Michael Young anymore. His attitude was so bad that he was hurting the team. Did you see him sitting on the bench during that Yankees series in a close extra innings game? He didnt want to be there and in turn the Sox didnt want him anymore. He sat out 50 something games for an injury that was supposed to be only a week. He has also never performed well in the playoffs and thats when it counts. Thats why I think Jeter is the best SS in the game, because he is just money in the playoffs and no one comes up bigger in key moments.

Its a good move for the Cubs because they dont lose anything yet they get an above average hitter who will help them for the playoff run. Its also a good move for the Sox because they get rid of a rotten apple who they werent going to resign and they get better on D, a problem for them all year. Great trade for both teams because it fills their needs.

Now all both teams need to do is get in the playoffs!

P.S. The Phillies are morons!

"Come on, get serious!" Arnold in Pumping Iron

[archive_MR. BMJ]

That makes sense.

I know the scouts have mentioned him in a decline, but I wouldn't count him out yet. Maybe a new scene and a fresh start will rejuvenate the guy. I'm not a Red Sox fan at all (Go Yanks!!!!!), but I have always liked Nomar (as well as Clemens when he played for them). It will be cool to see how all this turns out. The game w/ the Yanks, was that the one with the A-rod fight??? I missed that gamehttp://anabolicfitness.infopop.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif . I only got the ESPN highlights. I haven't had a chance to watch much TV this last couple of weeks...until 10-11pm at night that is.

I agree on the Jeter comment thoughhttp://anabolicfitness.infopop.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif....not because i'm a yanks fan, but because he always steps it up a couple of notches in the playoffs. I think he has gotten a bunch of undue negative press this year.

BMJ

[archive_Mickey]

No the game that I am talking about was in the last series in NY.

I am a big Clemens fan. Growing up he was my favorite pitcher and I wanted to be just like him, wearing his number and all. I had a big poster of him over my bed, with Jordan on all of the other walls http://anabolicfitness.infopop.net/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

"Come on, get serious!" Arnold in Pumping Iron

[archive_MR. BMJ]

Woops...almost forgot Wade Boggs. Those three have been my favorite Red Sox players over the last 20 years or so.

Hmmmmm....I thought Ulter would have a comment on this since he has some roots in Chicago?

BMJ

[archive_Ulter]

Nomar is a gift from the Gods. I just hope the Cubs can sign him. I don't care what he did in Boston. The Boston fans are the 2nd worst fans in the country behind the Yankees.
He got a standing ovation when he came to the plate in Wrigley Field and hit into a double play. The next time up he got another standing ovation. THAT's what baseball fans do for their team. In Boston they'd have booed him the second time up for hitting into a double play. They suck.
Nomar is going to be huge for the Cubs batting 2nd in front of Alou and Sosa. The scouts are right his skills were declining in Boston. He didn't want to be there and any scout who doesn't understand motivation should be kicked back to the curb. He wanted out and oh by the way still hit .325 3rd best in all of baseball at his position (Jeter .273 which doesn't even put him in the top 100). And we didn't even give up a pitcher.

"Education is what remains after one has forgotten everything he learned in school." -Albert Einstein

[archive_Mickey]

http://www.anabolicfitness.net/smileys/lol2[1].gif

Oh Ulter I was waiting for you to humor me.

His decline started before this year and that is supposedly when he got unhappy because he was so hurt by the trade that didnt happen. He had a major wrist injury and that is probably the main contributor. He has gone down the past 4 years since his great years of '99 and '00.

I cant say that I respect anyone, ANYONE, who tells their team that he is going to sit out the month of August because his heel is hurting again, then have his agent tell another team that he is fine to play. That is just pathetic. He told the Sox that he wanted to go on the DL starting the Minnesota series this past weekend and thats when the Sox realized that the cancer had to go. This is all happening in the middle of a playoff race by the way. Oh and did I mention that he is making $11.5 million this year to do this, hows that for motivation for playing hard? A-Rod hated playing in Texas but he still busted his ass every day because he was getting a fat check, and he has a heart.

The stories are going to come out and you are going to realize why the guy never had any friends there in the first place. I cant even stand to look at his face and that bullshit grin he always has.

I have no doubt hes going to put up nice numbers in that wind aided park off of Waveland Ave. but that isnt always the whole story. What is he going to do from the end of Sept. on? I just dont think this guy has heart. Like Bill Simmons said today, he could have been the weak link on a team that was an out away from the Series last year, just because he doesnt step up and I dont think anyone in baseball really believes that he has a heart. Not only that but no one really even wanted the guy. Boston had to throw in one of their best prospects for the Cubs to take him. What does that show about his trade value?

Boston fans gave his sorry ass a standing ovation when he sat out 50 something games for no reason. Those are good fans. They want to win. Good fans want to win and yearn for it. Bad fans cheer no matter what, even when their team hasnt won since 1908.

Passionate fans like NY, Boston, Philly, want to win. They are towns that expect their players who are making millions to play a game to play hard and always give their best effort. I get yelled at when Im at work if I slack off and could even get fired. Why is the same standard not held for these guys who are making millions to entertain?

I have never heard Boston get on Pedro and Im sure that has to do with the fact that he wants to win and has thrown when he was obviously hurt in the playoffs just to give his team a chance. I have never heard Philly get on Iverson, despite his problems, because he plays his guts out every time he is on the floor. Shit, Pat Burrell hit like .200 last year and he still got cheered every time up for the whole year, because we like him and we want him to do good.

Ulter I would have actually thought that despite your teams need for a SS that can hit, you hard working Chicago people wouldnt want someone like him, not because of his playing skills, but because of whats in that head and heart (or should I say whats lacking).

"Come on, get serious!" Arnold in Pumping Iron

[This message was edited by Mickey on 08-02-04 at 06:26 PM.]

[This message was edited by Mickey on 08-02-04 at 06:34 PM.]

[This message was edited by Mickey on 08-02-04 at 06:49 PM.]

[archive_Ulter]

I glad I could humor you. You didn't answer the fact that he's batting 50 points higher than your boy Jeter and is 3rd in both leagues at his position. So how you can you say that he's not earning his money? What are you saying he would have batted .370 if he was "playing hard" or a "team" player? He's batting 3 points under his lifetime average. Is that the decline 3 points? It's still the highest among actives. You're talking about him like he hasn't contributed to a team that has been saying for two years they don't want him.
Are you seriously going to tell me that this is first time you have ever seen a player that knows he's getting traded say he's hurt? It happens in EVERY sport.
OMG!! BOSTON has good fans???? Pedro? Yeah they trashed his car in Boston. Great example you picked.
But then you're from Philly where the fans are notoriously brutal, violent and destuctive so Boston may seem like a day at the beach to you.
Good fans support their team. They show up to the ball park and expect the players to give them a good game to watch win or lose. Of course Cub fans want the team to win, they are blowing out all attendence records this year (granted they have more seats). But they won't throw beer on them if they lose like Philly and NYY where players have had to get a police escort to leave. Eagle fans? I won't go there, it's too easy.

NYY fans are a joke and I have posted this twice. If the NYY don't win there is no one at the ball park. In fact, even when they DO win and the fans don't think they are good enough to win the WS they don't show up.
In the mid 90's the Cubs finished FIFTH and outdrew the division winning NYY who have a stadium that holds 30,000 more fans. Splain that.

What does Boston say?

By Dan Shaughnessy
Boston Globe

August 1, 2004


BOSTON -- Thank the baseball god, he's gone. We no longer have to watch Nomar Garciaparra pretend that he cares about the fortunes of the Boston Red Sox.

This is a strange story. No one ever played harder, or gave more, to the Boston Red Sox and the citizens of Red Sox Nation than Nomar Garciaparra. He was probably the most popular Sox player since Ted Williams, and rightfully so; no player was more worthy of your applause. But at the same time, no player polluted the clubhouse more than Nomar, and in the end, he was the ultimate non-team guy.

He had to go. He was more miserable than any athlete I have ever seen. In the Red Sox clubhouse, he was as happy as Michael Moore at a Bush family reunion.

----------------------------------------------------\

What does Nomar say?

"If it was in my control, I'd still be wearing a Red Sox uniform, because it's the place I know, I love. All of those fans, I'll always remember."

================================================== ==/

That's what happens when the front office says they don't want you. That won't happen in Chicago.



"Education is what remains after one has forgotten everything he learned in school." -Albert Einstein

[This message was edited by Ulter on 08-02-04 at 09:09 PM.]

[archive_Mickey]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="**-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> You didn't answer the fact that he's batting 50 points higher than your boy Jeter and is 3rd in both leagues at his position. So how you can you say that he's not earning his money? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

.300, .350, shit even .400. Great numbers. They dont mean shit though if you dont do it when it counts. What has he done in the playoffs? They won last year DESPITE him. He is the classic guy that puts up his numbers and takes home a big check and then makes excuses for when it counts. Jeter's averages have gone down every year also. Yet when October rolls around the guy is making the biggest plays that we will ever see in postseason history. Great players step up, Nomar doesnt do that. You were there when Karl Malone tanked it in the Finals against Jordan right? Didnt he win MVP? Scoring titles? How'd he do in the playoffs? Same situation.

Im not saying that Nomar is horrible. Hes a very good player and hes going to put up good numbers for the Cubs. Hes just not an elite player. Im sorry I just like guys with heart and he doesnt have that look in his eye. Like Bill Simmons said today in his column, he is like a guy like Jim Rice who puts up .300, 30 and 100 yet disappears when you need him. A money player is someone like Alou or Pudge, they are great when their teams need them to be. Randy Johnson, Clemens, Shilling, Rivera and Pedro (by the way I hate him) come to pitch when it counts.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="**-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> In the mid 90's the Cubs finished FIFTH and outdrew the division winning NYY who have a stadium that holds 30,000 more fans. Splain that.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I cant explain that or why the Cubs owners never put that money into actually trying to win.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="**-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>But they won't throw beer on them if they lose like Philly and NYY where players have had to get a police escort to leave <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Youre right about this. Its wrong and it happens. I would never do that though and I dont know many that do. However they do stuff like that because they are hard working people who pay a lot of money to watch millionaires try and win. We want to win so bad it hurts. Its just hard to explain.

Cubs fans are just happy go lucky. They dont care if they win or lose yet they are there to support. Who cares if the "Cubbies" lose, whats another year on top of 100? We still get to go to the stadium during the day and sing that stupid song during the 7th and guess who the guest singer is. I dated a girl from Chicago for over a year and this is how her father and her friends all were. It was almost shocking to me.

I really dont like to argue about this stuff because people who arent from NY, NJ, PA or Boston just dont really understand the mentality. People are just different.

I really hope that you dont buy Nomar's fake quotes for one second. His agent said that if they werent going to offer him $16 mil a season then he didnt want to be there. That really sounds like a guy who loves to be there in Boston "wearing a Red Sox uniform". Scott Rolen is so much better than Nomar its not even funny and he took a lot less than what he could have had to go to the Cards.

--------------------------------------------
I once asked Phillies manager Larry Bowa why the fans in Philly are so tough.

"They work for every dollar they earn," said Bowa, who was on the '80 championship team. "Nothing is given to these people. They're blue-collar workers. They love to see people get their uniform dirty. They love to see people put in time at their job. They love to see passion, emotion."

Glen Macnow, co-author of the recent local best-seller, "The Great Philadelphia Fan Book," said: "Here in Philadelphia, sports isn't a diversion. It's not entertainment. It's religion."

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=paolantonio/tortured_philadelphia

I know Chicago fans are great fans, but it just isnt the same mentality. Its one of those things that if you arent in those shoes, you cant really understand.

"Come on, get serious!" Arnold in Pumping Iron

[archive_Ulter]

Whether he plays in a Cub uniform for the next 5 years is yet to seen. The Cubs will not negotiate ANYONES contract during the season so we won't know until Nov.
You're right, the Tribune Company, among the richest owners in Baseball, won't pay him top dollar to stay. They know that players want to play in Wrigley Field. It's a great city, the fans treat you like Gods, you're on TV in 100 countries around the world through WGN, and the side money/business opportunities are huge. If you look around baseball there is no other city he can go to that can offer the things Chicago has, that would take him.

The Red Sox covered the rest of his contract so the Cubs aren't even paying him. I hope he stays, and I hope he gets a chance to choke for the Cubs in the WS.

Scott Rolen is better than anyone.

"Education is what remains after one has forgotten everything he learned in school." -Albert Einstein

[archive_Mickey]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="**-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>It's a great city <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

We hired a guy at work today who is also from Chicago. I was telling him how much I like that city and how nice it is. Its a wonderful place and I wouldnt care if I had to move there. I even like it more than Florida.

"Come on, get serious!" Arnold in Pumping Iron